Bloodhound1958 wrote:

Am I hearing you right Bob? A BIG BLOCK? Thought you had your heart set on a 318? I "Prayed" I could get you hooked into the Big Block club of Christine owners one day! Now this is a historical development worthy of all the exaggeration and embellishment I can muster!!!

Sadly, I don't know what the differences are between the early and late 383's. Hopefully John or Big Joe will chime in as they are both experts in that regard. I'm more of the 350 Golden Commando go to guy!

Yes...I've been looking for a running, driving BB donor car over here in our corner of the world. Please keep your eyes peeled for me would you? A BB would be better for this heavy beast...but still a nice built up 318 wouldn't be out of the question. Figuring out "best drop-in and most reasonable" is priority for me. Thanks...

Bob

58belvedere wrote:

Here is one!  Go get it Tigers!:

http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/cto/5381733998.html

This is actually very close to me. I will give him a jingle and see what he really has here!

Thanks Marc!


Brian.

Well, I found this pic showing a small block and big block 727 bell housing.

Good pic Chris It amazes me how close those two are from SB to BB.. Almost silly strange..



Brian.

Bob, I believe a 1962 Chrysler torqueflight is the one you want to get.

57belv wrote:

Bob, I believe a 1962 Chrysler torqueflight is the one you want to get.

Thanks Chris...for posting those pics. of each bell housing. Does this mean the actual transmission behind the bell housing is the same for BB vs. SB?

Yes, from all that I have gathered, a 62 torqueflite is the one. I take it that this 62 torqueflite could come out of any Mopar including an Imperial? All those Imperials have 413's in them too. Could that whole setup be dropped right in our Plymouths with some big block motor mounts and some mods. to the exhaust pipes?

I have also heard that just the tailshaft from the 62 torqueflite will bolt right on the transmission I have now in the car. So if I found one in a junkyard, I wouldn't necessarily have to get it rebuilt. I could just bolt the tailshaft onto mine to get the parking brake back. Can anyone here verify this?

Glad to hear that 350 sitting in the 68 Sport Fury is relatively close to you Brian. Let's hear all about it! And maybe if you don't want it...because you're leaning toward the LA 318, you could check it out for Don? Who this thread really belongs to.

:Marc : Poor hijacked Don...but you know what, this has been a great thread...very informative and it certainly has added a spark of energy 'round here. Thanks Don for understanding and for starting this thread. I hope you get a nice 350 out of it.

Bob

Well the guy that is talking to me said the block numbers on the motor block are 1944929. Does anyone know what that would be? I have no idea what the 1958 GC 350 numbers would be. Im starting to think all these motors look alike...LOL.


Brian.

That sounds like a casting number Brian. The 350 in my DeSoto is stamped L-350 on the block just below (right next to) the distributor cap. That area is prone to collecting dirt/grease, so hopefully the guy will be willing to clean/scrape that area.

Hey...I have a good donor car sitting right next to Green Christine.

Thanks Bob! I have no idea where one should look for numbers. It sounds like the guy is willing to look for me. He did send the block casting number 1944929. I will ask him what stamping there is around by the distributer. Again this is very unknown territory for me. But the guy does seem really nice and willing to give any info. Is there any other numbers one should look for?


Brian.

DevilsRide wrote:

Thanks Bob! I have no idea where one should look for numbers. It sounds like the guy is willing to look for me. He did send the block casting number 1944929. I will ask him what stamping there is around by the distributer.  Again this is very unknown territory for me. But the guy does seem really nice and willing to give any info. Is there any other numbers one should look for?


Brian.

Not that I'm aware of...this is the tell-tale stamp of approval! Hopefully Wayno will join in here soon. He'll know if there is!

Bob

Okay Bob So this stamping by the distributor is this on the block or head? Im confused where to tell him to look.


Brian.

DevilsRide wrote:

Okay Bob So this stamping by the distributor is this on the block or head? Im confused where to tell him to look.


Brian.

It's on the block right next to the distributor on a flat machined area, I'll get you a photo tomorrow.

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Brian, I'm sorry about the second photo...no matter what I do I cannot turn this photo 90 degrees. I've tried and tried...I've saved it right side up...but no matter what, it still shows up 90 degrees off. It's frustrating...I hope these help you.

Bob

More info: and pic.

http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=7112

The Stamping number is on the front passenger side of the machined block surface in front of the head near the distributor. A 350 will be stamped with L-350 with another set of numbers beneath.

Just watching to see what Brian finds out...

Thanks everyone for all the info and pictures. I will keep everyone posted of what this comes out to be. Right now I think we are looking at this being a 50/50 chance of a 350. In a little bit he is going to go out and clean the area below the distributor to find out what is there. Only time will tell folks. I just find this strange that this motor is sitting in a 1968 fury. But heck I guess anything is possible how it made its way to this car.

Again I will keep everyone posted ASAP!


Brian.

Cool, see if he can send some pics too!

Well after further investigating it looks like this is not a 350. The strange part is the block casting number says it is but the stamping below the dist. says no. Im thinking it is a 1958 350 that was punched out at the factory to be a 361...maybe... It is a single four barrel carb. I will let you guys look at the pictures to decide what this really is.













There you go folks! Tell me what you all think it is!

Brian.

It looks to be a 1958 361 block
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-classic-cars/winnipeg/1961-dodge-dart-phoenix-2-door-coupe/1097991017?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true
1961 dodge dart phoenix 2 door coupe
big block b series wedge head, casting number 1944929-5
and is a 1958 350 cubic inch with 2 barrel carb putting out 300 horse,
3 spd transmission, i'm not quite sure how many of these rare cars where built, 511 is the number i could find!
as far as the engine it was only produced for 1 year !!
this car i purchase at auction and it has 52300 miles which appear to be original! so i don't know a whole lot about it!
rare car come have a look!! serial# 5319117187 built in windsor, on.
$10,900.00 need cash for new venture!!!!
don 204 643 5715

http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=14600

http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=29421

Plymouth 1957-1959 On the 8 cyl it is located on the front of the block beneath left hand cylinder head. On the 19588-350 f, 8-361 engines, it is located on the right hand side of the cylinder block beneath the distributor
http://moparcarparts.com/instructions/50to65_Mopar_Parts_Interchange_Manual.pdf

This kinda looks like it might be a 59 dodge 361.
American 1959 Dodge engines included :
Get-Away 6 : 230-cid, 135 hp (ML230- ) - Coronet 6 (MD1-L)
Red Ram V8 : 326-cid (A block), 2-bbl carb, 255 hp (ML326- ) - Coronet V8 (MD2-L)
Ram Fire V8 : 361-cid (B block), 2-bbl carb, 295 hp (ML361- ) - Sierra (MD3-L) and Royal (MD3-M)
Super Ram Fire V8 : 361-cid (B block), 4-bbl carb, 305 hp (ML361- ) - Custom Royal (MD3-H) and Custom Sierra (MD3-H)
D-500 V8 : 383-cid V8 (B block), 4-bbl carb, 320 bhp (ML383- ) - optional all
Super D-500 V8 - 383-cid (B block), 2 4-bbl carbs, 345 bhp (ML383- ) - optional all

Ha ha good one Bob!



After Chris and I talked about it and the info he found with other info from here I think it would be a Super Ram Fire 361 V8 single 4bbl carb at 305 HP. (ML361). Basically a punched out 350 block. Make no mistake its not a L 350 but none the less its a cool motor and was one of the power houses of its time as far as I can tell.


Brian.

Makes one wonder if they didn't just take already cast blocks and bore them to larger specs hence the 58 350 casting number but the 59 361 stamping. Hmmm........

Chris, That's what im thinking also. Which would make good cost effective sense. I think this would still make a cool motor to have in a plymmie!



Brian.

DevilsRide wrote:

 Chris, That's what im thinking also. Which would make good cost effective sense. I think this would still make a cool motor to have in a plymmie!



Brian.

Great investigation Marc, Brian and Chris...

This is great stuff. Your (theoretical) conclusion makes very good sense to me too. The leftover 58 blocks with those 58 casting numbers could have been bored out at the factory and then stamped ML361 for the 59 cars.

If in my area of the country, I'd definitely be interested in this car/engine...a little more powerful than the 350, definitely looks just like the 350 and would drop right in green Christine's engine bay. Are you guys interested in it since it's close and you're both looking for v8's for your cars??

Bob

Well, speaking about big-blocks in '58 Plymouth's, the Mopar big blocks I like is the 440's. I mean, really like the 440's.  
It's funny, I like the 440's and the idea of a 440 in a '58 Plymouth so much that I am seriously considering putting a 440 into the '58 4 door.
Yep, you read that right, a 440 going into a 4 door.

My dad thinks that I'm crazier than all git-out to want to put a big bad 440 into a 4 door, and he may be right. But hey, it's my car, my money, and my say so on what I want to do with my car. And also it will be very unexpected when I take my car to car shows and pop the hood and people see a 440 in there.

A well built 318 is very respectable. Back in the day I bored mine .060 and installed 11.5:1 Jahns racing pistons, an Isky super road and drag grind, headman headers, Mallory dual point, 2 AFB carbs, and balanced. It pulled very well. I was using a 3 speed with overdrive and an 11 inch truck clutch hooked to a 3.54 rear. She surprised many a 327 Chevy and others bigger. For safety I was using 57 Chrysler 12" drums front and rear with a power booster. I wish I had that Fury clone today.

eva_392 wrote:

A well built 318 is very respectable.  Back in the day I bored mine .060 and installed 11.5:1 Jahns racing pistons, an Isky super road and drag grind, headman headers, Mallory dual point, 2 AFB carbs, and balanced.  It pulled very well.  I was using a 3 speed with overdrive and an 11 inch truck clutch hooked to a 3.54 rear.  She surprised many a 327 Chevy and others bigger.  For safety I was using 57 Chrysler 12" drums front and rear with a power booster.  I wish I had that Fury clone today.

Sounds great Ron...Sounds like you had a lot of fun back then. I wish I had the gear-head abilities you have. The very best I think I can do is do a motor and tranny swap. And that's going to be a stretch I think. Probably will take me a looong time. Perhaps I can get my neighbor to help or perhaps even a couple of car-cruise friends. Looking for a good donor car close to home right now and that in itself looks to be quite a challenge. Looks like a 62 model will be the best. Sounds like you've had good success with older drive-trains though...from what I gather. That's what the 392 is...correct? older?

Thanks, Bob

Yes, the 392 was only in 57-58 Chrysler and Imperial.  The Imperial is much harder to find and has a higher nickel content making it very desirable.  6 years ago I totaled a 57 Belvedere with a 392 and cast iron torqueflite.  I am now working on another 57 Belvedere with a 440 and 727 trans.  I hope to have it road worthy in the spring.  The previous owner really butchered the electrical system with crimps and stray wires everywhere.  I prefer to solder and cover with heat shrink tubing.  So, there is a lot of electrical work to do.  I have a purple shaft and closed chamber heads to install.  Should give her a nice boost in power.  I also have a pair of closed chamber heads I will be selling soon.  Good luck with your project.  In case you didn't know, there is the "old CCC" site out there with a world of knowledge on it.  The site crashed a few years ago and now is just an archive.  No changes can be made.  Check it out for some technical ideas and help.

eva_392 wrote:

Yes, the 392 was only in 57-58 Chrysler and Imperial.  The Imperial is much harder to find and has a higher nickel content making it very desirable.  6 years ago I totaled a 57 Belvedere with a 392 and cast iron torqueflite.  I am now working on another 57 Belvedere with a 440 and 727 trans.  I hope to have it road worthy in the spring.  The previous owner really butchered the electrical system with crimps and stray wires everywhere.  I prefer to solder and cover with heat shrink tubing.  So, there is a lot of electrical work to do.  I have a purple shaft and closed chamber heads to install.  Should give her a nice boost in power.  I also have a pair of closed chamber heads I will be selling soon.  Good luck with your project.  In case you didn't know, there is the "old CCC" site out there with a world of knowledge on it.  The site crashed a few years ago and now is just an archive.  No changes can be made.  Check it out for some technical ideas and help.

I remember reading about your accident...not sure if it was here or not. 6 years ago already huh? Glad you are here to talk about it. I also now remember you were selling that 392...and trans too? Probably had no problem selling because now that I've started to acquire some knowledge that sounds like a very desirable setup. Sounds like you are making good progress on your 57. Best wishes to you with it. I've had some electrical messes in my past projects too. Takes a lot of patience! Thanks for reminder about the old CCC...I'll have to take some time and check it out.

Bob